Lunch Break with Sydney Utehdahl at The Fulton
The esthetician and founder of Dorian Skin Studio talks about her career, where to save in your skincare routine, Eurovision, and our shared love for a good old-fashioned tangent!
Welcome to the first episode of Lunch Break, my exciting new interview series where I chat with fascinating people over lunch!
Before we dive in, here are a few important notes. As I mentioned on Sunday, this letter includes two parts: a written transcription of half the interview and an audio recording of the entire conversation. Moving forward, the audio will be exclusive to paid subscribers. However, since this is the inaugural episode, I want all my readers to enjoy full access. This way, you can share your feedback on what you like and what you'd prefer to change. I aim to make this a permanent feature of the newsletter, and I want it to be the best it can possibly be!
At the end of today’s letter, you’ll find a few polls. It would mean the world to me if you could participate and leave your thoughts on what you enjoyed and what could be improved. Feel free to DM me here or on Instagram as well! I'm thrilled about this series, and as a token of my appreciation, I'm offering a 30% discount on subscriptions for the next 72 hours! Enjoy the episode and happy listening!
Before we dive into the episode, a quick note: I recorded this during lunch, so you'll hear typical restaurant sounds—clinking silverware, background music, and even a bridal lunch party. I did my best to minimize the background noise, but please let me know how I can improve it further!
This interview has been edited for length and clarity.
Jalil Johnson: All right, great. Could you just state your name?
Sydney Utendahl: My name is Sydney Utendahl.
JJ: Perfect. And it is, what's today?
SU: What is today?The 24th? No.
JJ:Oh, it is the 24th.
SU:Is it?
JJ: I should know this. It's the 24th. It's currently 1:25, and we're at The Fulton. Okay, great. So thank you so much for joining me for the first Lunch Break.
SU: Thank you for having me.
JJ: So, I guess we should set context of how we met for the audience, so we met at Palm Heights.
SU: Yes.
JJ: It's going to be about a year and a few months.
SU: Yeah, or a year. It was my birthday last year, I think overlapped with Palm Heights. Did I make that up? No, I went twice.
JJ: Oh, amazing.
SU: Oh, yeah, a year and a few months. You're right, you're right.
JJ: Because it was in August kind of.
SU: Oh, yeah. Yes, yes, yes.
JJ: It was amazing.
SU: It was amazing. We had so much fun.
JJ: How are you connected to Palm Heights?
SU: So my sister did some work with Gabby [Gabriella Khalil] , and we kind of got introduced that way, and then we met Chris [Christopher John Rogers], and then we were on the trip.
JJ: Yes.
SU: It's so fun. It's so beautiful there.
JJ:It's amazing. I am dying to go back. It's my happy place.
SU: Yeah. I know, it's like it's heaven there, and it's nice because I feel like every ... I've been twice and I'm going again in a month, and every time I've been there it's so small, but in a very, I don't know, like you can stay there for five days straight and not feel like you're trapped.
JJ:Yes.
SU: You don't even need to leave. Even though I kind of want to at some point when I'm there, but I do love that there's so many different themes in the hotel. All the restaurants feel like they're in different places. It's great.
JJ:I told Gabby one time that it feels like a living, breathing Pinterest board.
SU: Yes. There are so many photo ops.
JJ:It's so good. You cannot take a bad photo there.
SU: Yeah, you really can't.
[insert photo/ pull quote]
JJ: But enough about Palm Heights.
SU: Yes.
JJ: Well, I'm really excited to talk to you too, because you're an esthetician, and something that I have loved experiencing as I'm getting more acquainted with my skin is trying to find a Black esthetician, which is actually a lot more of a challenge than, I mean, I guess it's expected. No, it should not be expected.
SU: No, yeah, there are a lot of Black ... I mean, Black people obviously are the highest consumers in the beauty industry overall, whether it be makeup, hair, whatever, but I do feel like there's not a lot of exposure with Black estheticians. When I was at esthetician school, it's like the majority of us were Black or Brown people, there was maybe one non-Black, Brown person in my whole class, but I feel like a lot ... We were all kind of talking about how all the more famous estheticians, there's only a couple Black people that we know, but there are a lot.
JJ: Yes.
SU: I feel like they just don't get a lot of exposure, which unfortunately is kind of like life.
JJ: Which is terrible.
SU: Which is messed up, especially because we're the highest consumer.
JJ: Yes. There's so many questions I have to ask you about that as well, like what made you want to get into this world? Because you started out as a product developer before you became an esthetician, and I'm just wondering, one, what made you want to get into the skincare world, and then that path from product developer to esthetician?
SU: Yeah. So I actually decided ... Well, I've always been a beauty girl, in the sense that I've always been into makeup, and been curious about skincare, but I feel like the skincare industry didn't get this huge boom until probably five, seven years ago. Everyone just knew about Proactiv, and Clearasil, and Neutrogena when it came to problem skin. So probably seven years ago, I started experiencing really bad hormonal acne, and I went to so many different estheticians and dermatologists that just destroyed my skin, and didn't know how to treat Black skin because we scar very differently. There's a lot of postinflammatory hyperpigmentation. We're more prone to keloids, and our melanocytes work very differently than white skin.
JJ: Can you say that again? What is the word you just said, and what is that?
SU: So postinflammatory hyperpigmentation is what happens when there's trauma to the skin, so like acne, scarring, or even just a cut in general, but when you have more melanin you scar differently, so more melanocytes are sent to that area that has been traumatized, whatever it is. So that's scarring that is more of a brown, purple scarring, and the treatment for that is different because you need to work on ... there's certain melanocytes inhibitors that you can use to treat those scars that aren't necessarily like skin bleach, so that would be niacinamide, that would be kojic acid, and different acids, AHAs, BHAs, whatever. But long story short, I was experiencing really bad acne for the first time, and then I had all this scarring, I was trying to treat both at the same time, which you can't, you need to treat the acne first, and then treat the scarring afterwards.
But I was just getting a lot of mixed information that was not helpful, and I, honestly, was not going to people that look like me. Then I went to a dermatologist, and an esthetician that were working together that did a really good job, and they gave me advice that I had never experienced or gotten before. During that time I was like, "Wait, I love skincare and I want to do what I love, so why not kind of dive into this journey of starting this career into skincare, while I personally am experiencing skin horror?" So then I got connected with a couple of people who were starting a brand, and that's when I got introduced to Soft Services, and they hired me as their first employee, and I was doing product development there. So I kind of started knowing actually nothing in terms of the process.
JJ: Then Soft Services, which I also recently discovered was founded by an ex-Glossier.
SU: Yeah, two ex-Glossier employees.
JJ: Which is so interesting. So did you help develop the whole beginning array?
SU: Yeah. So the whole beginning products, a couple of them are still rolling out, but specifically the Buffing Bar-
JJ: Which is my favorite.
SU: It's so good.
Jalil Johnson: I use it every day.
Sydney Utendahl: It fixes everything, ingrowns, keratosis pilaris, every texture issue you have on your body. It's so abrasive in the best way. It's the scrub you need for your body skin. So the Buffing Bar, the Smoothing Solution, the body acne spray, and a lot of the beginning products, and the retinol hand cream….we've been swarmed.
JJ: Oh, my God, it's a ...
SU: It's a bridal lunch.
JJ: There is a bridal lunch right next to us, which I've never experienced. I never knew there was a thing as a bridal lunch.
SU: Right, this is all news to me too.
JJ: This is going to be interesting.
SU: I know.
JJ: I feel like this adds to the story.
SU: It does, very New York lunch.
JJ: Yes. It's so funny. This is hilarious.
SU: We were like, "It's getting quiet in here."
JJ: So you were saying you developed those early products.
SU: Yeah. So I helped develop those products, and I was the first and only employee for about a year, and then the team expanded a little bit, but it was very small and I learned so much.I was working directly with labs. I was doing a lot of things that a lot of associate product developers don't get an opportunity to do. I had a lot of exposure, I learned a lot of things very quickly, it was very hands-on. I was involved with packaging, and just everything, copy, I didn't write those things or create the packaging, but I was able to see them, and see the processes around them.
JJ: I have a random question about the products, because again, I love Soft Services, they're amazing. I've used several, the one I always go back to is the Buffing Bar. Why is it the color blue? Not why, that's an aggressive way, but what-
SU: No, no, why is a good question. I think it was just an aesthetic thing. I think it just looked great. I remember we tried a bunch of different colors. The original color comes just what it was made out of, it was kind of like a, almost like an eraser color, that kind of weird off pink gray situation, and I think the blue just looked the best. Yeah, I'm pretty sure that's what it was. Now they have a green banana scent of it, which smells amazing, and the color is also cool, it's this yellowy green color.
JJ: It's supposed to smell like unripe bananas, which is such an interesting choice because it wasn't until I started using the bar where I was like, "Oh, that is a very distinct smell."
SU: Yeah. Rebecca, she killed it. She did a really good job with that.
JJ: Who is Rebecca?
SU: Rebecca [Rebecca Zhou] is the CEO. She is absolutely amazing. She's a genius and she's-
Jalil Johnson: That's amazing. So from there, you went from?
SU: Yes, so I'm not really a desk person, I love to talk, I love to walk around, I have ADHD, I need to move my body, so I left Soft Services. I didn't know if I wanted to stay in product development or if I wanted to be an est ... I didn't know what exactly I wanted to do, but I did know I wanted to go to esthetician school to just get more credibility and to learn more. I, unfortunately, don't think I learned much of anything in esthetician school in terms of ingredients. I feel like they actually didn't do the best job when it came to that, but obviously I learned how to get facials. When I was there, I decided that, "Oh, wait, I love being hands-on." I love talking to people, and I had kind of developed this small following of people on the internet that really trusted my skincare advice, and especially the majority were Black women, and I feel like I'm a place of comfort for them to send me pictures and ask me questions, and give answers that are based on experience.
I also don't do any paid reviews of products, which is a little bit hard, but it's also what keeps my following trusting me. I'll only do a paid review if I've already reviewed it, and I'm like, "I love this and I use it," and then the company is like, "Hey, will you do X, Y, and Z for me?" And I'm like, "Oh, I do love it, and I've been using it, so yes, you can pay me for this." But I want to just give full honest reviews of things, and I want to try things out before I tell somebody to buy it.
JJ: So with that, you went to esthetician school.
SU: Yes, and then decided to become-
JJ: And decided to open your own-which it's kind of a very interesting time now to open up a business, because I feel like it's the best of times, the worst of times. And so I'm wondering, well, I have a few questions with that too. The name of your esthetician studio is called Dorian Skin Studio, and I'm wondering what made you choose Dorian?
SU: That's my middle name.
JJ: Oh.
SU: I know. People think it's about Dorian Gray.
JJ: Dorian Gray, yeah.
SU: It's kind of cool, all the different theories that people have around the name. It's just my middle name, and I love the name. I wanted to choose something that I could potentially turn into a line one day. So I looked at Sydney Skin, and I don't know, it just didn't really flow. I would love, if I have a line one day, Dorian is so such a cool name for a brand. I always was like, "I need to use Dorian for something," and I don't want to name my kids Dorian, not that I don't love that name, I'm just kind of like, "I have other options."
JJ: It's such a good name. I was one of those people where I was like, "Oh, is it tied to," because also it's kind of apt, Dorian Gray, a story of someone that wants to stay young.
SU: Exactly, and I was like, "Oh, cool." I'm like, "Believe what you want to believe."
JJ: So how long has Dorian been open?
SU: Since December. It's been open since December, but I was doing friends and family. Sorry, been open since November, but I was doing friends and family for a couple of months, and then it was open to the public mid-January. It's been doing really well.
JJ: Whenever I click to book an appointment, it's always booked.
SU: Well, what was happening was that in the beginning I didn't have that many appointments, because I didn't think that that many people would actually be like, "Oh, I'm coming in." So immediately my appointments ran out, which was amazing. I totally had imposter syndrome, and I was like, "What the hell am I doing?”….
SU:So all my appointments ran out really quickly, which was amazing. I felt like a celebrity who had launched a skincare line and it sold out within five minutes, not that I had ... I had like 12 appointments up, and I was like, "Why….
JJ: But it was still amazing.
SU: Yeah. No, I couldn't believe it. It was so sweet because everybody who came in, I remember my first stranger, because at first it was people that I kind of knew, my first three appointments were people that had gone to school with me that I didn't really know, and then getting total strangers who were saying that they had been following me for years and they couldn't wait to come in, that was the best feeling. Then getting people who rebooked appointments was probably the moment where I was like, "Okay, I'm doing something right here because that means that they wanted to come back, and they liked what they saw."
I like to be very honest when I treat people's skin, and I don't like to overdo it, so I don't overdo extractions, I extract what is ready because I don't want people to scar. I don't like to overcomplicate people's routine. If your skincare routine is you're washing your face with body soap, and slathering Vaseline on your face and your skin looks incredible, the only thing I'm going to tell you to do is add sunscreen every single day. Other than that, you don't need to over complicate it because clearly your skin likes what you're putting on it.
JJ: Yes.
SU: But then some people are like, "Okay, my skin looks great, but I want to have a more even skin tone, or I want more hydration or plumpness," and so I always have a long list of products that work for that, but I'm not into overcomplicating skincare at all.
JJ: That's good. So that brings me to this question. I did a beauty-specific Substack, where I got a group chat of four people that were in the beauty industry together to talk about skincare, and I got questions from my readers, but also my followers on my Instagram. One of the questions that someone asked was, "Where can you save and where can you splurge in your skincare routine?" I'm asking you now, where do you think you can save? Where should you splurge? Do you have product recommendations specifically for people with melanated skin? I mean, everyone has melanin, but like-
SU: No, but melanated skin, totally. I think you can save everywhere, but I think in terms of where I really am adamant that you should not spend a lot of money on is on cleansers.
JJ: Tell me more. Why?
SU: So there are so many cleansers on the market that are so expensive that have a lot of marketing claims that I don't think make any sense, because if you think about it, the product is not sitting on your skin long enough for those ingredients to be efficacious. Let's say there's a cleanser that claims to be an anti-aging cleanser, that doesn't make any sense, you're washing it off your face almost immediately. A lot of the anti-aging ingredients, let's say it's a retinol cleanser, retinol needs to stay on the skin for a certain amount of time for it to work. Also, most retinol ingredients don't live well in an alkaline environment, which alkaline, there's different pH levels, but face washes and soaps are very alkaline. So cleansers don't need to be complicated. I think that you need to make sure your cleanser cleanses your skin well, but doesn't strip your skin.
Those are the two things that I tell people. I'm like, "Make sure it gets the gunk off, and the dirt, and the sebum, and the oil production. Get all of that off, but don't strip your skin because then it'll overproduce oils, and then you'll have a whole other problem, but you need to cleanse." Also, I tell most people, "Cleanse at night."
JJ: You shouldn't cleanse in the morning?
SU: No, I cleanse in the morning, but I cleanse with an oil cleanser in the morning because I don't want to mess up my skin's pH, and I'm not sleeping in makeup or anything. So if you want to cleanse off your skin, you can use just water, but I do cleanse my, because I use retinol at night and stuff, so I do like to use something, but I use an oil cleanser.
JJ: Got it.
SU: Yeah.
JJ: So cleanser is somewhere where you can save.
SU: Yes.
JJ: Well, you were saying everywhere-
SU: Sorry, I'm going on tangents.
JJ: No, no, this is my favorite thing.
SU: Okay, good.
JJ: I love tangents. Well, also I'm going on a tangent right now.
SU: No, go. Go, I love it.
JJ: The thing that my boyfriend and I always kind of get in tussles about is because I am prone to start sentences, and then go on a different way or different journey.
SU: I mean, I have ADHD, you can send me anywhere.
JJ: But then in my head I'm just like, "I'm making sense. You just got to follow the journey."
SU: You got to follow. You got to pay attention.
JJ: Yes, pay attention.
SU: If you're lost, that's your fault. You know what I mean? Keep up. Be quick.
My skincare tangents are always crazy. Someone will say, "What Chapstick should I get?" And by the end of the conversation I've gotten to under eye creams.
JJ: Yeah, like, "This is a conversation."
SU: Yeah, this is like, "Come on, stay with it. Focus."
JJ: We're going somewhere. I feel like it's adding color, tangents.
SU: It's adding depth.
JJ: It's a je ne sais quoi.
SU: Yeah, exactly. Exactly.
JJ: So please, go on as many tangents as you want.
SU: Thank you.
JJ: I endorse a tangent-
SU: My skincare tangents are always crazy. Someone will say, "What Chapstick should I get?" And by the end of the conversation I've gotten to under eye creams.
JJ: Yes. Which, can I tell you my favorite lip balm?
SU: Yes.
JJ: Which I feel is so random.
SU: Right.
—-
JJ: Well, we are approaching the end of our lunch break.
SU: Oh, my God.
JJ: So since this is Consider Yourself Cultured, I have to ask you some wrap up questions about culture. This was amazing. You've been fantastic.
SU: Great.
JJ: So my first question is, who is the most cultured person you know?
SU: Oh, my gosh. What do you mean by cultured?
JJ: That's the thing. Cultured, I think takes on a different meaning for everyone, which is also what I want to explore in the newsletter, because I'm realizing that I kind of attribute culture to taste, but I also kind of attribute it to knowledge. I think it can take on so many-
SU: I think of it as like knowledge, but maybe when I thought of it I ... Because I feel like typically people think of cultured as somebody who's just well-traveled, which I feel like is kind of elitist, classist way of looking at it, because so many people are so cultured and know so much and are so knowledgeable, but don't have the opportunities, resources, whatever, to travel, because traveling is really expensive.
JJ: It's so expensive.
SU: So many of my best friends are so cultured, and are so knowledgeable about every culture, and teach me so much. Probably my best friend, Requel. She is just so open-minded and knowledgeable about the world. Raquel.
JJ: Raquel, you're the most cultured person according to Sydney. What is your latest cultural obsession?
SU: Like Black culture?
JJ: Again, it's up to your-
SU: I don't know, I feel like this ... Wait, I need to really think. I don't know. Can you give me an example?
JJ: What are you obsessing over? Let's see, for instance, my latest obsession right now, culturally is, actually this is very random, I somehow got into a TikTok loop with this, the Eurovision competitors. There's this one from, I think The Netherlands called Joost or something, and his song is called Europa.
SU: Okay.
JJ: I have literally watched his performance countless times. I'm just like, and usually with TikTok I'm just like, "Okay, I've seen this," but I actually watched it all the way through.
SU: Eurovision. What's Eurovision?
JJ: Eurovision is that competition-
Sydney Utendahl: I'm I crazy?
JJ: No. I don't know the full scope of it. I think it's just like a ... think of American Idol, but it's nationally sponsored.
SU: Oh, yes, I've seen this. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
JJ: ABBA won one year.
SU: Okay.
JJ: So Joost ... I think his name is J-O-O-S-T, I think that's his name, but his song is Europa, and that's my cultural obsession right now.
SU: Okay.
JJ: Again, I think this could be whatever you interpret it.
SU: I think because I'm addicted to TikTok, I have a new obsession every single day.
JJ: Yes.
SU: I'm constantly learning new things, and it's not good for my brain, for sure.
JJ: It’s terrible.
SU: It's too much information. When I think about the things I'm obsessed with right now, like I'm obsessed with perfume, I'm obsessed with gardening, those are my two hyperfixations, but cultural things?
JJ: I feel like that's culture though. I feel like-
SU: That is culture. Okay, there you go.
JJ: Because I feel like culture takes on a different ... I don't think there's a concrete like, "This is what it means to be cultured. This is what is culture." I don't believe in a highbrow or there is highbrow, no, there isn't. There is no highbrow, there is no lowbrow, everything is high, everything is slow.
SU: Right.
JJ: Gardening, I think, also, they're connect ... Everything that you're kind of interested in ties back into health, the skin.
SU: Yeah, and kind of like pampering yourself.
JJ: Yes.
SU: I have a balcony and I decided, I don't know why, I just let it look ugly for the last four years. Finally, two weeks ago I was like, "It's time to plant flowers and garden."
It's like ... My TikTok life is very different than my Instagram life, they're like two different girls.
JJ: What are you planting?
SU: Marigolds. I tried to plant petunia flowers because my dog's name is Petunia, but I don't know what I'm doing. At the end of the day, I'm on YouTube watching gardening videos, so we'll see. I realized I had a plant outside that was dying, that simply just was not an outdoor plant, so that's where I'm starting from.
JJ: Have you heard of the brand Gardenheir?
SU: No. See, I don't know anything yet.
JJ: Look it up.
SU: Okay.
JJ: You're going to become obsessed. I solely want to garden because of this brand.
SU: Okay, cool. Love it. Yeah, so gardening. Perfumes though, the fragrance situation, I've stayed away from fragrances for so long because I don't love them in skincare because they're allergens. Some people are fine with putting on fragrance lotion, but I feel like I haven't paid attention to fragrance for so long, and now that's my crazy hyperfixation. I also made my TikTok a perfume TikTok.
JJ: Oh, that's so-
SU: It's like ... My TikTok life is very different than my Instagram life, they're like two different girls.
JJ: We're multifaceted beings.
SU: Yes, and it's like you got to hustle in every way you can.
JJ: I know, trust me. Okay, so the final question to wrap up this lunch break, it's a three-parter. So what should everyone watch? What should everyone listen to? And what should everyone read to consider themselves cultured?
SU: Okay, everybody should watch ... I'm a big documentary person. One of my favorite movies, which I don't know if this is corny or not, I don't think it is, but it's just kind of very common maybe, but for New York culture everyone needs to watch ... Wow, I'm blanking on the name even though it's my favorite.
JJ: Is it-
SU: Spike Lee.
JJ: Do the Right Thing?
SU: Yes, exactly. I do watch that every summer or every spring.
JJ: It's not corny. It's so important.
SU: I love it. One, I love it because there's this feeling of being really hot in the city, where everybody collectively feels the same gross stickiness. I don't know, there's just something about it. Obviously, the movie shows you every type of culture that's in New York, and everyone's beefing, and you realize everyone is fighting their own battles to a certain extent, but I just think that it's one of those movies that if you're new to the city, you got to watch it.
JJ: Yes.
SU: It just shows you what's going on, and the energy that New York Summer is. New York Summer is my favorite time of year.
JJ: It's amazing.
SU: Yeah. Growing up in New York, you get on the train and you see every type of person. You see the finance guy. You see the addict. You see the-
JJ: The mom.
SU: You see the mom. You see the basic girl. You see the fashion guru. You see everybody. You see the kids going to school. You literally are just so exposed to so many different types of people so early on that I feel like most New Yorkers, no matter what demographic, who you are, what you look like, you are cultured because it's unavoidable.
JJ: Yeah, and then what should everyone read? Oh, wait, listen to and read, so the next one is what should everyone listen to?
SU: Listen to? Listen to? Podcasts? Are we talking music?
JJ: It could be a podcasts or music.
SU: I think everyone should listen to Brazilian music. I don't know, it just makes me feel so good. Every morning I wake up and I play Bebel Gilberto, and there's just an energy to it that kind of just ... it also kind of sounds crazy, it makes me feel alive, and ready to get up and go. I don't know what they're saying, and that's what I like, it's just good music.
JJ: Well, no, I don't think it's corny because as soon as you said Brazilian music I just think of coffee and sunshine.
SU: Yeah. I think in general, music really shapes ... It weirds me out when people don't listen to music.
JJ: Yes.
SU: If I'm in a bad mood and I put on a good feeling, good energy album, whether it be like Lauryn Hill or Brazilian Music, or even Kendrick Lamar, whatever it is, it'll shape my mood and make me feel so much better, or the opposite, if I need a good cry, I'm putting on Phil Collins.
JJ: Oh, Phil.
SU: Yeah. I also think that that's a part of being cultured too, is going through someone's music library and being like, "What do you listen to?"
JJ: Which Phil Collins song?
SU: Against All Odds.
JJ: So good.
SU: No, it's like it's ... I've walked out of drug stores because that's playing because I will cry, even if I'm in the best mood ever, that is my tearjerker song.
JJ: What is it about?
SU: I think it's such a sad song, and in my mind it represents a lot of different people in my life. Every time I think about it and hear the lyrics, it's like it could be so many different people who I've lost in some capacity or been hurt by. It just really triggers that for me. I don't know what it is. My friends laugh about it because there's been times where I've been in an Uber and this song turns on and I'm like, "Turn it off," because it's kind of like a drug store... it's like a pharmacy song.
JJ: It's a very weird song. Also, thinking about it to play in a pharmacy because it is so-
SU: It's everywhere. No, when you start to pay attention, for some reason, that song is everywhere.
JJ: Phil must be getting so much money.
SU: He's paid.
JJ: He's paid.
SU: He's getting a bag from CVS.
JJ: Okay. Now what should everyone read?
SU: Read? I like to read a lot of coming-of-age books. I like to read books that are very, I don't know if they're in the same genre of coming-of-age, for example, Pachinko, which is an amazing book, and then the Elena Ferrante, My Brilliant Friend series. Elena Ferrante, My Brilliant Friend series, which is an Italian writer, and her series is it's about these two girls, they're friends, and just their lives. The way it's written is so beautiful. They just really paint an image for you, and it takes you out of where you are, and I really love that. But in general, I always recommend people read different types of books from different cultures, so whether it be like, I don't know, I don't stick to one genre. I stay away from fantasy and stuff. But, I honestly only started reading during COVID. I went my entire life without finishing a book. I'm talking middle school, high school, college.
JJ: Really?
SU: I didn't finish one book. I thought people who said they liked reading were like people who said they like to go to the gym, I was like, "You want attention." You know what I mean? I was like, "This isn't real." I was like, "That's annoying." I didn't think it was a real thing, and then during COVID, when I was quarantined in the woods, staring at a wall, I was like, "Let me pick up this book situation," and I became obsessed. Every book is like a new Netflix series I fell in love, and I learned so much. I like that you can imagine your own characters, everybody has a different vision in their head. But yeah, so I like My Brilliant Friend series, Pachinko, and American Marriage is another really beautiful.
JJ: Oh, I have that book, and I have not picked it up.
SU: It's one that might make you cry, but I think it's really, really cool.
JJ: I can't wait, and now I feel so much more cultured.
SU: Yeah, there you go.
JJ: Well, thank you so much for joining me.
SU: Thank you for having me. Thank you for listening to all my tangents, and incomplete tangents.
JJ: Well, I love tangents.
SU: We're a match.
JJ: We're a match made in heaven.
SU: Thank you.
JJ: Well, thank you. All right.
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You're very good at this! I look forward to more and love your site!
sydney is an icon!!!!